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Forum: System: Basket Futures I

New?Last PostPosted By#Subject
1/16/12 (0:22)Marat Salgan11Weekly comentary
10/20/11 (7:22)Marat Salgan2Technical problem
10/07/11 (2:14)Marat Salgan5Questions & Answers from subscribers
9/05/11 (3:20)Marat Salgan3Basket Futures I Description
8/15/11 (10:56)Marat Salgan1Service interuption

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Subject:Questions & Answers from subscribers
Posted by:Marat Salgan (Admin) ( C2 Score: 939)  New msg
 
Ignore user's posts for week month forever
When:10/05/11 (5:27) 
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This is a root message for system publisher Q&A. I will post valuable questions from subscribers and public and my answers on them. Please do not post replies to this root message.
  
 
Subject:Questions & Answers from subscribers
Posted by:Marat Salgan (Admin) ( C2 Score: 939)  New msg
 
Ignore user's posts for week month forever
When:10/05/11 (5:39) 
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In response to post by Marat Salgan of 10/05/11 (5:27)

This is a root message for system publisher Q&A. I will post valuable questions from subscribers and public and my answers on them. Please do not post replies to this root message.

Subscriber Question
Your system is doing amazing well. The system seems to capture most the trend at the right time, meanwhile other systems on C2 is having hard time to find trends. I wonder if you can offer smaller systems with same algorithm that can fit account size 50k and 100k. Although I do realize that smaller system may not offer the performance that the current system do since it will do a smaller set of commodities and therefore lack diversification. But most investors have 50k or 100k to trade. 200k is probably hard to come up with. Please let me know if this is feasible in the future. Maybe you can run a back test, say 50k system, from selected commodities for the bigger system and see how it compare to the big system. If the smaller system still have comparable result, then it would allow customers to build their capital and when they have enough capital, they can switch to the bigger system.

Answer
Thanks for the kind words. System performed quite well in real time simulation over the last six month, but nothing like now. These are special circumstances and will unlikely to repeat to the same magnitude. It will perform to a degree of 30-50% compared to current performance in normal volatility.

There are two characteristics which make it so expensive to trade. Relatively large potential losers, up to $2000-2500 each and large set of markets. With today's margins, when fully invested it requires around 130K just for margin deposit alone. Add to it 20% potential draw-down at 40K and you have 170K to trade minimum so you can sleep well at night. When I was designing the system, I had maximum performance in mind. Apparently, it comes with the cost.

If you download CSV file from C2 with all the trades and sort it by the markets, diversification issue becomes apparent. Some markets are still expenses while selected few drive systems positive performance. It takes some markets 6-12 month to become profitable. If I knew how to isolate those performing markets or performing periods, I would make it a part of selection algorithms. I do not. I use exact same logic on all the markets. I decided to publish Basket Futures I because I realized that I could not trade it myself. Hopefully there are well capitalized traders out there who can. I agree with your idea, even for my own use. However, at this moment I simply do not have time to go through the exercise.

So, you can attempt this for yourself. Get list of markets from CSV file, find your broker margin for each market x volume. Group markets by Group /metals, grains, energy, currency, softs, equity index, interest rates, meats/. Pick two markets in each group. This will give you subset of 16 markets and lower your margin requirements to 50-90K depending on selection. Turn auto-trading on for these markets. Test this in simulation for a month, see how it does.

When I have time to do the work, I will attempt to construct smaller portfolio. There are some technology issues I have to solve to do that. That's why I do not have a back test portfolio results for the BF I at the moment. It is a matter of putting in the hours. I will let subscribers know as soon as something new becomes available on this matter.

Marat
  
 
Subject:Questions & Answers from subscribers
Posted by:Gennaker ( C2 Score: 521)  New msg
 
Ignore user's posts for week month forever
When:10/05/11 (9:26) 
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In response to post by Marat Salgan of 10/05/11 (5:39)

Subscriber Question
Your system is doing amazing well. The system seems to capture most the trend at t...

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Your system along with others are high performers. What you have in common with other high performers is your C2 score sucks. Why is this? Because of your high performance?
  
 
Subject:Questions & Answers from subscribers
Posted by:Marat Salgan (Admin) ( C2 Score: 939)  New msg
 
Ignore user's posts for week month forever
When:10/06/11 (10:01) 
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In response to post by Gennaker of 10/05/11 (9:26)

Your system along with others are high performers. What you have in common with other high performers is your C2 score sucks. Why is this? Because of your high performance?

Experienced C2 subscribers do not care much about C2 score. They would go to the Grid to make their own selection. They would select "Find a System"->"The Grid". Then they would filter instruments to "Futures". This would produce a list of all C2 Futures systems.

Next, they would narrow it down with criteria:
"Age" > 60 (days in history)
"# Trades" > 30 (trades total)
"Ann return" > 200 (% annualized return)
"Max drawdown" < 30 (% maximum historic draw-down, should be prepared for at least 1.5*max_drawdown)

At the moment of writing, this narrows list down to five trade-able systems. Basket Futures I is one of them. If you sort this list by "Sharpe Ratio" it gets to the top of the list. With systematic approach, no discretionary trading, 24 hours real time execution and 8 sectors diversification Basket Futures I is one of the best systems on C2 suitable for long term trading. And it is free to subscribe to at the moment! Personally, I would much rather get subscribers who could make such decisions for themselves rather then rely on some magic single number.
  
 
Subject:Questions & Answers from subscribers
Posted by:Marat Salgan (Admin) ( C2 Score: 939)  New msg
 
Ignore user's posts for week month forever
When:10/07/11 (2:14) 
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In response to post by Anh Nguyen of 10/06/11 (10:51)

Well said Marat! When searching for a good system on C2, I would look for low draw down and reasonable % return and then...

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I appreciate the praise. HOWEVER, if there is anything I learned from the markets it's to stay humble. At the moment Basket Futures I is the right approach for the right market state. BUT it WILL lose money in sideways markets.

I would like to urge subscribers to
A. Stay humble, do not expect this level of return to last.
B. Be mentally prepared for draw-downs. They happened in simulation over last 6 month, up to 20%. They will happen in the future. The key is to keep attitude of consistency and trade through the draw - down until the next income period comes along. Do not over - leverage with the expectation of current bonanza to last indefinitely. There is no single system on C2 which accomplished that.
  
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